by Ben Blatt
A version of this post can be read in the Wall Street Journal here.
Like all sports rivalries, picking a side in the Red Sox-Yankee rivalry is almost entirely geographic. Everyone knows as you drive through the traffic-filled highways of Connecticut, bumper stickers will slowly fade from those supporting the Sox to those supporting the Yanks. But exactly where is the border between the two fanbases? Although others have tried to answer this before, by using data from the 2.5 million people in New York or New England that ‘like’ either the Red Sox or Yankees I was able to create a more accurate rivalry map than ever before.
To figure out where the true boundaries are I used Facebook’s ‘Create and Ad’ feature. By pretending be buying an advertisement, Facebook will tell you the approximate number of people in an area who ‘like’ something. For instance there are 101,400 people in Boston who like the Red Sox (of which, 280 are also 18-year old males who also ‘like’ Justin Bieber).
I went through towns in New England and New York to determine the percentage of people who like the Red Sox versus the Yankees. Using this data I was able to trace out the borders of the two fanbases. Below is the final map.
Surprisingly (or possibly unsurprisingly) the borders of Massachusetts and Vermont turned out to be the actual borders of the two rivals. I had thought it was possible that Red Sox Nation might extend into northern New York or Yankee territory might extend into Vermont. This turned out not to be the case. Check out the map below of the border between western Massachusetts and New York as an example of how pronounced fanbases change on different sides of a state border (Note: For some of the towns their populations were combined for the graph below because they were too small otherwise to get accurate data).
The true battleground is, of course, Connecticut. Looking at the raw data we see the state is very mixed.
With the exception of a few outliers, towns in the Northeast (and especially those towns which border Massachusetts or Rhode Island) have a high concentration of Sox fans. Towns in the Southwest (especially the towns that border New York) have a high concentration of Yankees fans.
Drawing a border through Connecticut using the map above and the data was not easy. I decided that a border should be contiguous. This made it impossible to group all the Sox-leaning towns on one side and all Yankee-leaning towns in the other. The border I came up with is below. There are several other borders that could have been drawn that would have been similarly accurate. My border tried to maximize the number of towns with more than 50% Sox fans on the Red Sox side and the number of towns with more than 50% Yankee fans on the Yankee side.
If you click to view the map you can see which towns lay on the border. This border differs significantly from the map that John Branch created in his New York Times article ‘Where Do Rivals Draw the Line’ . His map plunges the border of Red Sox Nation much farther into western Connecticut and cedes the major city of Hartford to the Sox. According to the Facebook data I was working off of, Hartford is 57% Yankees fans, a decided advantage. I think my map is able to command accuracy far greater than the Times article (which was based on driving around towns and surveying strangers) or other methods. Facebook provides a survey with an unprecedented sample size.
Just in case you are a big Connecticut geography nut, I have attached the same shaded map as before but with the towns labeled. Also below is a ranking of each town in Connecticut in order of the highest to lowest proportion of Red Sox fans (some towns were left off the list because they were too small and did not have enough data. For the map an average of the surrounding towns was used).
The towns above are highlighted based on whether or not they were grouped into Red Sox or Yankee territory on the map. You can see that many towns had more than 50% of one fanbase but were put in the other’s territory. While you could play around with the borders more, there are many places where it would be impossible to draw a contiguous border and not have any outliers like this.
While I don’t think any of the results above are groundbreaking there was one result that surprised me the most throughout this research: there are 262,500 people who ‘like’ both the Red Sox and the Yankees. If only I had time, I would map out where they live so that every true baseball fan can avoid them.
Ben Blatt can be contacted at bbblatt@gmail.com.
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I realize that it’s not in dispute between New York City and Boston, and that there are the Mets and the Phillies to contend with (at least, figuratively speaking). But if you’re going to include the entire State of New York (the western edge of which also has Pittsburgh Pirate, Cleveland Indian, and even Toronto Blue Jay fans), then you should also include New Jersey.
However, based on my own observations, I think your map is pretty accurate, although I would have figured on New Haven being only slightly more Yank than Sox, and Hartford definitely being majority, perhaps supermajority (3/5 to 1/2) Sox. The minor leagues (West Haven Yankees in the ’70s, Norwich Navigators in the ’90s, New Britain Red Sox until the Twins turned them into the Rock Cats) also have something to do with my perception.
I call the divider the Bristol Line, after the home of ESPN, which would really have to work harder to fill programming without the rivalry.
It’s easy to see here based on your findings that ethnicity is playing a role in which team is dominant in the border towns. Towns dominated by minorities such as Bloomfield, East Hartford and especially Hartford seem to root for the Yankees based on the fact that NYC is a very diverse and immigrant dominant city and Boston is a traditionally white city. Rocky Hill actually serves as the mid-point based on driving distance however it seems like other factors come into the equation.
Boston being dominate white, not true. That’s just the popular view, Dorchester is very diverse Black Hispanic and Asians, Roxbury and Mattapan is predominate Black, A lot of Asians in Quincy MA, Cambridge is diverse because of the major colleges. You assumption is false.
Umm you are obviously not from here (Boston)…I have lived in both Boston and NYC and know many people who also have. They would agree with me when I say Boston is, and for quite some time has been a very ethnically/racially diverse city. The great thing about B-town is that while there are of course neighborhoods that contain larger groups of certain ethnicities over others, the mixtures in different neighborhoods are more heterogeneous…where as unfortunately in New York the many different ethnic groups live in virtual segregation in their own corners of most neighborhoods. While we witness the sad regressive state our nation has fallen into, racial tensions in NY are [surprisingly] bubbling to a head all over again. I am glad I live in a city that does a good job of being racially inclusive and peacefully coexisting. The Sox weren’t always reflective of this, but we are all proud that they have done a 180 in that regard. We love our diversity and our BoSox. GO RED SOX!!! 😉
Boston area is the 7th most segregated. https://www.masslive.com/news/boston/2015/08/boston_is_7th_most_racially_se.html
This is not true in northeastern ct it says 100% are Red Sox fans when I know that’s not a true statement!!
Same with Vermont. All my friends and relatives are Yankee Fans except my 85 year old Mom.
Andrew – look at all the tables, not just the graphic. No towns are 100% Redsox, but towns like Thompson and Pomfret are 85-90% Red Sox fans, which make them look very “red” on the graphic representation. Read the full data table later in the article for a more complete breakdown town-by-town.
Reblogged this on HARDWOOD and commented:
This is baseball, but its sweet
Don’t overlook the Italian influence. The Yankees have had many Italian stars such as Joe DiMaggio, Yogi Berra and Phil Rizzuto. Connecticut has a very large Italian population.
Bingo… Thats the deal. Italians go yanks and the Irish are sox fans. I also agree that the minorities back east usually go yanks based on boston being perceived as a white town.
But oddly enough those two teams were the last two in the majors to integrate…
The second last team are in fact the Tigers.
I am not sure why the race card got inserted in a topic like this, but as far as CT goes, here is the bottom line. CT is IN metro NYC, so the Mets and Yankees are actually LOCAL teams to CT, while the Red Sox and Boston teams are out of market to ALL of CT. Why? Boston is light years away from most of CT while NYC is as little as ten minutes away.
The other factor is Hartford market news channels who report on Boston sports as if they are local to parts of CT, which causes confusion. It brainwashes viewers who do not receive NY/NJ TV into thinking that Boston teams are local to CT simply because CT is ‘called’ a so-called ‘New England’ state, which has ZERO meaning.
Plus, places in CT that are too far away from NYC think they are closer to Boston because they are nearer RI, but Boston is STILL quite a distance away. The one thing I have noticed is that no matter where you are in CT, NYC sports are supported everywhere, as they should be because those are our only LOCAL teams!!! So there is no battleground because only on city has rights in CT and the other is too far away for us to be concerned with.
North End is a Large Italian community in Boston
How do demographic differences (between the Facebook-using&RedSox/Yankees-liking fans, and the fans in those areas that are either not on Facebook or if they are haven’t “liked” either team) influence the results here and is there any indication of how that might affect the placement of the borderline between the fan bases when those other people are factored in? (I imagine there might be a huge number of those people and that they probably aren’t geographically distributed the same way the FB users are and also maybe not symmetrically with regards to each team.)
selection bias
Thanks for this! As a native of a split-loyalty town in CT, I was interested to see the breakdown.
A question about your methodology: how did you identify residents of a particular town on Facebook? I ask because parts of Connecticut have a strange system where towns are made up of villages (for example, Storrs is a village of Mansfield, not an independent town) and many people identify with their village instead of their town. For example, I am from Willimantic, CT, which is census-designated place in the town of Windham (about 18k out of the town’s 24k residents live in Willimantic). But I would never consider myself as being from Windham — everyone I know from Willimantic puts “Willimantic” as their hometown on Facebook. But if you were working backwards from a list of CT towns, you might miss Willimantic residents entirely. Perhaps you accounted for this in your original methodology, but if you did not, I just wanted to give you a heads up because the village system would tend to undercount residents of more densely populated, more diverse areas, especially in eastern CT. If there is any validity to a previous commenter’s point about ethnicity accounting for some of the split, leaving Willimantic out of the Windham statistics would skew the results (about 40% of Willimantic residents identify as either black or Hispanic, while the villages of North Windham, South Windham, and Windham Center are more white and rural). Which is a long way of saying that my Facebook friends were surprised to see Windham lean so heavily toward the Red Sox in your analysis.
Finally, an explanation as to the historic split between Canaan and North Canaan!!!
Haha congrats cannan on being relevant. Pretty funny Norfolk had 3 people vote (I assume that based on the 66.7 percent, but who knows maybe it was 6) being from Norfolk though is say it’s accurate; more sox fans.
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One issue with CT is that there are nearly 60 colleges and universities that might be causing some of the discrepancies. With each averaging around 10,000-20,000 students. it could cause the data in a particular town to change.
True. Many of those students come from up in the New England area to CT so they can live in metro NYC and have access to NYC and they bring their Boston sports propaganda with them. They hate the fact that CT is in metro NYC and is not a state that worships Boston. No need to deal with 3rd or 4th tier cities that are hours away when America’s #1 is right next door.
What a ridiculous map. I grew up in upstate NY. I didn’t know anybody who liked the Yankees. We despised anything “big city” what with their “we’re better than you hicks attitude. You’ve got to be kidding. Since the O’s/Pirates/A’s/Reds were the best teams in the 60’s/70’s, we mostly followed one of those 4 teams.
Me? I’m an O’s fan for sure. Yankees suck. Just as much as that cesspool of a city.
Have you ever been to New York? I have never met someone here who thinks they are “better than you hicks ” because my friends from upstate NY are nice people. And NY is the most fun city in the world. Are you as prejudiced against races and religions as you are against cities?
The orioles have the worst fans.
And you’re saying you’re not a dumb hick ? Lol !!! Idiot
Ima die hard Yankee fan. I lived in the Boston area for 9yrs. I’ve hated the Red Sox since I was a kid but never truly learned to completely despise them until I lived amongst Red Sox fans. I love the city of Boston but Red Sox fans have to be the biggest most arrogant people around. Not all of them though. I won’t label them all assholes but a big majority are. The first game I ever went at Fenway park was you guessed it, Yankees , Red Sox. My fiance was called every name in the book and I had beers dumped on me. The next time around friends and family came up from Brooklyn and Queens. 30 Yankee fans sitting in the bleachers at Fenway. We made our point. I was one of the happiest people in the world when the Sox finally won it all in 2004. No more whining about the curse or anything. But the fact that Boston that night looked like the LA riots after Rodney King proved to the world that most Red Sox fans are ignorant drunken fools. And don’t even get me started on Patriots fans
I grew up in the Boston area, was raised a Sox fan, and have only been to one Yankees game at the old stadium. It wasn’t even against the Red Sox (they played the A’s) and I did go with my uncle, who is a die hard Yankees fan. I don’t think I have ever been more afraid in my entire life! So many drunks with rude comments and I was only 13! Gross. I never said a peep about the Red Sox because the fans around me were so belligerent and the Yankees WON that game back in the mid 90’s. Everybody can have a bad experience. It’s difficult not to judge, but it’s also difficult to forget a bad experience. I now live in a divided town in CT and I try to keep baseball out of my friendships with Yankee fans for a reason. Just like with politics, passion is hard to contain and if you don’t agree with that particular passion, it’s difficult to deal with.
I definitely have to agree with you. Politics and sports are very much alike when it comes to friendship and conversation. I have family members I will absolutely not discuss politics with. Or even religion for thst matter. You make a very good point and I respect that. I have seen many sports fans in general act like complete asses. I had a bad experience at Fenway and you had a bad experience at Yankee Stadium. It happens every where and that’s very unfortunate for people like us who just want to enjoy a game
Confused here CTSox Girl? Are you saying that your negative experience in Yankee Stadium was becasue you were obviously a Red Sox fan? Or are you saying that the Yankees Staduim experience was simply negative? Been in many stadiums over the years and you can find drunks anywhere and rude ppl everywhere but the only place people threw golf balls at my head was in Fenway, while rooting for the Yankees with friends of many colors (mostly not white). I go to Fenway many times a year but try to make it a day game and stay away from the drunks. In fact, I do my best to stay away from the drunks just about everywhere – but big city girls learn that early.
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Interesting. Yankees territory tracks pretty closely with Metro-North service area: http://parkitnyc.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/Image_Metro_North_Map.png
Christ people – there is no logic, none, to being a yankee fan if you are North/East of New Haven. And even New Haven should be a solid Sox fan. From New Haven to the North and East you are a New Englander – have some pride. Also, might I ask: why are they the Yankees? They aren’t new englanders and given that New York abstained from voting for the declaration of freakin’ independence they sure aren’t worthy of the name, but I digress.
The term Yankee is actually derogatory in origin. I would not want to be associated with the term any more than an African American wants to be associated with the “N” word. It comes from the Dutch word “Janke,” which literally translates to “Little John.” It was a word used to describe a thief or pirate in the 17th and 18th centuries. Maybe the Yankees ARE aptly named…
Ct sox girl, that’s the first time I heard that explanation. They adopted the name the Yankees because all American League teams were called the Americans, They were thought of as lesser compared to the National league. It was easier for the press to call them the Yanks than the Americans. In fact the Red Sawx were known as the Boston Americans at first, then the nickname changed red Sawx after the Cincinnati Red stockings. Go SAWX!
Yes, you are correct with how the Yankees got their name, but etymology is quite a different story. It just proves that word meanings get twisted and changed over time. The word has taken on many meanings over the years and has been used to describe anyone from the USA (one evolution of the meaning, as in what you mentioned above), people just from the northeast, or just people from Connecticut, which is where the Dutch come into play; they were the ones settled in New York, who originally called people from Connecticut “Jankes” or Yankees. The Dutch felt that the predominantly British/non-Dutch people of Connecticut were stealing land from them, among other things, hence the derogatory term. The term has evolved quite a bit over time and is now not an insult at all. The history/etymology is quite interesting actually.
CTSoxGirl I agree. “Yankee” is a derogatory name! I often wonder why it never comes up in conversation when they are discussing a name change for the “Redskins”?
Because the historical oppression of Native Americans is so much greater than the historical oppression of the white Americans to whom “Yankee” is generally applied? Jeez, get a grip.
We are not “New Englanders,” that is a Boston thing. CT is in metro NYC – not metro Boston!!!
wrong. new england is CT, RI, MA, NH, VT, ME. that’s just a fact. Ct is not in metro NYC. Only the tail part. Fairfield county etc. I am in New London county right next to RI. 5 minutes from RI. It is Sox fans here an quaint New England towns w no NY influence or culture. The state really has 2 cultures. A New England one and a NY one.
As a CT NATIVE, we always saw “New Englanders” as YOU people in MA/Boston region – not us! We knew nothing about you and not one I knew went out there much, if at all. Not many of us knew about Boston until the age of the internet. We in CT are in metro NYC – not metro Boston. New England is YOUR thing, Tri-state or MET(s)tropolitan NYC is OUR thing, so we have pride in this NY/NJ/CT Tri-state area! Boston? We know nothing about you and could care less. Stop begging for our attention.
If you were an immigrant to this country and they asked you what city/region would you like to go to, would you choose Boston over American’s premier city? Of course not. Most would choose between NYC and L.A. as first choices. Boston is just trying to get fame from CT being in metro NYC, but we don’t like Boston and they are too far away. Mind your business, we have nothing to do with you! Save that NE BS, that is YOUR thing and the Patriots are YOUR team, not ours.
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I’m curious if you thought of cross referencing the data with television coverage? I am a Yankees fan who grew up in Wallingford in the 70’s. In mid-southern CT, we grew up with 2 of every major network station from both CT and NY. So we watched a ton of NY news. We also had Channel 38 and 56 out of Boston – but it was mostly Bruins and Creature Double Feature – Godzilla vs Mothra. I always felt that that was the big driver of Yankess fans – that fact that we got much of our news and consequently sports news from NYC. I don’t know if its still the same in CT with Southern CT getting NY stations and Northeast CT watching Boston news.
As for the “likes” for both teams: “Liking” something on Facebook is their functionality for subscribing to news about that thing, like a Twitter “Follow.” Those people might actually be really serious baseball fans who are interested in keeping up with news surrounding both teams.
I live in an upper Hudson Valley county in upstate NY that borders on Mass. Locally, I see as many people wearing Red Sox adornments as Yankee (rarely Mets). Maybe it’s due to Mo Vaughn years ago befriending a local boy and his family who was a cancer victim, or perhaps it’s the nearby NE influence and the easy drive to Boston. In any case, I’d be careful about Facebook being a true proxy for sports loyalties. You may have heard of the Truman-Dewey election eve miscall in 1948 when pollsters only counted votes from people with phones!
Actually, that was the ’36 election between FDR and Alf Landon, and only one poll made that mistake, but it was the biggest one. The issue in 48 was that they stopped most polling too early, and Truman had a then-unprecedented late surge.
Thanks for the correction, although I still stand by that parallel. The analysis used a source of data that is questionable as to how representative it is. It’s likely that plenty of older fans either aren’t immersed in Facebook, or don’t express in it their sports team affiliations as part of their core social identity. Also, I may not have expressly specified my affection for a particular team, but the hint of specifying Bill Lee as one of my heroes would probably tip off any serious baseball fan… I happen to know a number of ardent Red Sox fans locally. So you’d have to qualify the conclusions that, as sort of reflected in the title, “if you look just at Facebook users who expressly indicated being fans of particular sports teams, then . . .” and follow with an acknowledgement of the likely limits of the data source in any attempt to use it as a proxy for the general population.
I thought this was a fantastic map that gives a true overview of the state. I grew up in Connecticut (in Avon for 5 years and New Canaan for 7) and certainly felt the pull of the Yankees get stronger the closer I got to New York. Lucky for me, in my formative years and in the town of Avon that was fairly evenly divided, I decided to hang my hat with Red Sox Nation over the Evil Empire. One of the best decisions of my life. Go Sox!
I wwould suggest that you see the movie “Fever Ptch “.It is an old movie but one of the best example of what it is to be a Red Sox fan– you can forget all the championship games that the Yankees have won, but that series when the Yankees were up 3 games to nothing for the Sox ,and the Son won four straight from the Yankees was the best moment of my life
I love every minute of it and the Evil Empire went down to defeat.
Having been born in New Haven (1924) and attended public schools there, believe me we were Yankee fans. No one would dare dispute that. During world series days, we could sit in the “shop” and listen to the broadcasts–but only if NYY were playing.
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How can you explain New London? Pretty far east to go Yankees…
Another thing to look at is the distribution of baseball-themed ice cream flavors. I live in Burlington (northern Vermont) which is solidly Red Sox territory though it has a sizable Yankees contingent (there are a couple of Yankee-themed bars). One way you can tell is that the stores sell “Comeback Caramel” which is the Red Sox flavor.
It’s not so surprising to me that the Vermont-northern New York border is sharp, because on the northern half (which is where most of the Vermont population is) the two states are separated by Lake Champlain. You can’t just pop over from here to NY State for a drink.
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Best wishes! Where are your contact details though?
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Burlington Vermont checking in here. HUGE yankees territory. You cant go more than a few feet without seeing a Yankees hat, Sox hat not nearly as common. Burlington is on the border of NY, but way more Yankees fans here than Sox fans no question about that. Almost everyone i know is a Yankees fan in Burlington and Western Vermont, as you go into Eastern VT no question red sox fans but no on lake champlain its solid Yankees territory
How do you feel not being near Boston, being near NYS, being called a New England state and having people assume that means you are Boston devoted? I know I hate it being in CT and this NYC region.
I can drive to NYC, do what needs to be done and get back in little time. If I drove to Boston, I would have to spend 6 hours driving (there and back), which would consume half a day. You almost need to stay at a hotel while there. CT is not in metro Boston, and we love it!
Here are the FACTS that puts this nonsense to rest! The FACT is, CT is IN metro New York City, so our ONLY local teams are the NYC and NJ teams – ALL others are out of market teams! CT is NOT in metro Boston (Boston is so far away) and New England is NOT a metro area, TV market or anything other than a name from old colonial times.
It does not matter how much the corny people in Boston/New England keep huffing and puffing and otherwise hating on the FACT that CT is not only 10 minutes away from NYC, but in the NYC region – we are not in the Boston region and your sports teams are ALL out of market to ALL of CT!
I also agree with someone earlier who wrote that NJ should be included. In fact, only you outsiders would add the ENTIRE state of NY and act as if they are one with the city. We never do that. This is the Tri-state area (NYC metro) and that is how it is! Boston – if you don’t like it, try moving your city closer to CT or just minding your business and leave this NY/NJ/CT region alone!! Boston is foreign to us.
Again, it does not matter if EVERYONE in CT were Boston fans, it does not count because they are out of market teams to CT!!! Case closed. I also know you people move or visit CT wearing your Boston sports teams, acting as agents who think we are supposed to cheer for a far away, SMALL city. NYC is the nations #1 town – who would take Boston over that? At least NJ has a back up with Philly, being a 2nd tier city, while Boston is 3rd tier.
I see MA, NH and RI plates on these CT roads leading to NYC and beyond – even in parts of CT so far away from MA< that you ask why these people do so much driving if they love Boston so much? They know they love NYC, but Boston is so far away from the main parts of the northeast and the main cities on the NE, that they feel lonely up north. Boston and Philly are HATERS!
It makes sense that CT has more NYY fans because everyone in CT is from New York and most of ’em only came here after 9/11. Other than that though, all the real CTers are New Englanders and Red Sox fans at heart. Connecticut is New England, not New York. During the revolution, CT, RI, MA, NH, and ME (part of MA) were the New England region, and their identity grew different from NY, so CT is New England and Red Sox Nation!
GO SOX and btw, who has more World Series this Century?
Boston-’04, ’07, ’13
New York-00′, 09′
Yes, a lot of recent carpetbaggers. And again, there are an awful lot of Red Sox fans in Eastern New York State, regardless of Facebook-only data. To draw sweeping generalizations from Facebook is rather sophomoric….
That is the garbage you jealous Boston people would believe. We are not “New Englanders” and we have never referred to ourselves a such – that is YOU people and your corny region. We are in metro NYC and we have nothing to do with Boston and we want nothing to do with you – you are too far away. YOU want everything to do with us because we are metro NYC.
You would have to be a fool to say that people came from NYC to CT after 9/11, that is dumb. You clowns up there keep acting as if people in CT are supposed to come from Boston or something. Boston is too far away and CT is right near NYC. I noticed a lot of you New Englanders come down here to move to spread Boston propaganda, trying to act as if you are from here. Once we see the Boston gear, we know you are not from here and you hate the fact that we hate Boston, but you love NYC which is why you are here and not in your Boston region.
For us, it is not Yankees/Red Sox, it is Yankees/Mets.
On the contrary, a lot of upstate New Yorkers are passionately devoted to Boston. Much of this has to do with the fact that they resent downstate New Yorkers for their condescending nature and political dominance. With that said, some of the most fanatical Boston fans you will find are in upstate New York.
Amen.
Invaluable piece – Coincidentally , others want a CT Town Map , my husband came across a fillable document here
https://goo.gl/9ifQyK
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A radio station in Albany NY broadcasts all the Red Sox games, apparently to no listeners since according to the study no one over the eastern New York border is a Red Sox fan.
There is a real need for an alternative to the present right wing media monopoly. It is a fact that most of the world’s news provision is operated by right wing moguls. Their aim is to spread the cause of capitalism and increase the world’s gap between rich and poor. Left Insider offers left wing news from reliable news sites like Novara and Left Foot Forward etc. Everyone has the birthright to fully exploit our own potential and we all have the obligation to assist others achieve theirs.
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